Episode 20: David Bianciardi on The Risk Of Innovation, Programmable Content & Virtual Reality

this is a software defined survival where we explore how software defined systems are changing the business of IT today software defined survival in ninety percent of what we build will never be seen by us or the client until it until all on site all the station for months and months the game engine use game characters who behave like our users eight slash you think about it we created a whole feedback three they sent to the occupants and the generation of media but we’ve done it all virtually the custom custom custom all the time how are you going to retain some of that intellectual property and I know how and actually build a reusable modular tool kit my name is Patrick Murray ends today’s guest founded avian city in nineteen ninety nine where he leads a team of designers developers and engineers that deliver software driven installations to enhance storytelling place making connectivity and responsiveness and I’m really excited to hear more about what all that means and how an AV programmer like myself can start applying some of these ideas so welcome to the podcast David beyond Chardy David welcome I think is there anything about that introduction that you’d like to correct or expand upon no I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head in terms of what our practice in our churches end up bringing to the built environment and %HESITATION yeah I’m really looking forward to expanding on our yes so I think a great place to start is %HESITATION obvious I want to talk about software but can you just tell us a little more about storytelling place making all these these different terms where I might just might just call in the navy system you’re getting a little more involved in a little more descriptive and how you describe that can you are kind of good that it more perspective for me surely if we think about a navy system or you know the software layer sitting on top of me these and these are the what of the of the physical installation of the functional behavior I’m so really the story telling the place making all of those descriptions of the worker really about the outcome in the why why would you put in place in the first place whose objectives the on the stakeholders died in on the user side are we trying to me %HESITATION and really more about how do the various layers of technology soft and hardware design and intention come together are designed outward behavior in a space space that has behavior or a list behavior %HESITATION and %HESITATION treating gauge where I could do something really vague to and %HESITATION purely emotional in an art piece or it might be really didactic an informational %HESITATION or it might be more about a brands just trying to evoke a sense of themselves in their physical spaces that they greet both gas and being part of the branch unity it’s excellent that’s a good description I like the way you put that so it’s a dumb it really depends on the outcome it’s it’s really the user experience or even the stakeholder experience like if you’re trying to get your brand of costs across so that kind of clear things up for me can we dial it back in %HESITATION tell me a little bit about yourself and and how you got started in analytical AV but this this kind of area is kind of an industry yeah and really it’s it’s I need your sectional kind of place that we live in where at this intersection of experience design which is a term that need to be unpacked Leslie %HESITATION and software design and development and systems and hardware design and and %HESITATION integration so those three things coming together %HESITATION yes we do have a foot and what would be typically known as the street arm my background really %HESITATION sounds a little eclectic but %HESITATION it all comes together in the end I went to school for music and music composition and released on myself increasingly writing music for contemporary cartographers and dance companies led me into here where my idea pieces were getting really more sound design oriented shows that more more complicated and I realized that I could write software that would help %HESITATION actually show control even increasingly complex a complex productions and you know but in the late nineties that turned out to be very useful to folks building theme parks are your I was finding ways of making things talk to each other to exhibit design behavior are collectively show well that’s really if we think about that early uses of experience show in experience design it kind of really came %HESITATION into market first in those explicitly being then Byrom but looking for a little bit more cultural ovation brought in %HESITATION you know the areas where we could apply the are these insights bills we started to really support museum designers so here again folks calling themselves storytellers looking to use digital layers to expand their power how they could express Sir engage their audiences now a days %HESITATION we really think of story telling us something that everybody in some way is doing %HESITATION in order to position themselves or explain themselves or invite others to understand brand institution are you a piece of architecture %HESITATION and %HESITATION we can support artists who are rather you know in their own way %HESITATION using the same mix of of skills and techniques to create the work very interesting that there comes again music is a gateway drug to some kind of a V. design or career in technology and I think there’s something to that like you mentioned sound design when you’re working on a piece of music learning an instrument I think there’s a lot of similarities with that and taking a technology apart and and figuring out how to use it in different ways and it sounds like you had an interesting career path and you brought it back to the thing that ties it together being storytelling and %HESITATION I really like that concept I had Ryan Howard on the podcast a few weeks ago and he wrapped it up to that as well saying that even you know your most basic conference room somebody’s start telling stories that’s the intention of the whole thing can you dig a little more deep into that yeah and a and I think they are you know writing %HESITATION is the super smart guy and I think you really understand I’m again the why of these types of installations are initially we think about %HESITATION and later in the conversation I hope we’ll get to talking a little bit about how these things come about and what what are a why are we are we were turning on the stakeholders investment and %HESITATION so that is an intangible are why and it really needs to be %HESITATION bolstered by an understanding of these more measurable engaged right and so it’s fine to use them %HESITATION I’ve been may be and I have a cultural story to tell and I’m really thinking about immersing myself in their culture and then figuring out what using out all the important threads and then finding all these ways of %HESITATION growing %HESITATION these threads into a sort of full blown understanding and and and not my audience your imagination that might be true of a brand as well who decide that they really want to have their gas in their visitors to their corporate headquarters %HESITATION game %HESITATION fuller sense of who they are possibly gauging where and your business where your arm it might be a visitor news a perspective shot employee who wants to get excited about and understand more about the company that there I’m about to team up with so it’s really an opportunity to engage with more senses are in a left wing near %HESITATION region casual way but show me don’t tell me I’m Bob Greenberg job who runs RGA award winning major agency had the opportunity when %HESITATION recently moving their offices consolidating from a number of buildings into one grand space that overlooks the Hudson yards in New York City we had an opportunity to look at how they engage with their visitors and his insight dial down almost a triviality but his insight was no we bring these people into our spaces we drag them down a hallway into a conference room and we must file a power point and we start to run down this linear lose run capabilities and deputation and so on and really %HESITATION what his insight was making it it’s something that bears out were up for many of us is that actually are conversational engagement or taking a walk around the state were introducing some folks are working on interesting things ended up resonating much more gas so they actually just went and took the whole thing and turned inside out created a media ribbon and that flows through the entire two story space and is this constant sort of bubbling up of the things that are important to the agency that things are important to their brand clients of the work that they’re doing %HESITATION and this allows leadership to meet specs or clients both on the marketing side also on the H. R. side of tracking talentless that %HESITATION walked in space and as they’re walking through the space will come up to a work group that might be doing something interesting and there’s some headlines or some older viewers and then sighed about what they’re working on and it sparked conversation and so really I think that kind of taking a walk through the story as opposed to sitting down and having it played back linearly is just a a great example of what we mean by storytelling usable space and in that case in almost very clean cation all are still has a very pragmatic outcome that they’re looking for but they managed to run package from this one mode and bring it out and use the whole state that sounds like a really powerful thing to do and I like the way you started it right we drank people down the hall instead of doing that the moment they walk in the building you can start telling your story and engaging those senses ends really just branding yourself and so I would see something like that and if there was no content on it I would call it digital signage right and for a long time digital signage was just menus and advertising and if a company says I want to digital signage installation well you just throw a couple screens on the wall and that’s about it right now they’ll figure out their own concept but with your approach it sounds like there’s a lot more work up front to find out what the real goals are and then the technologies is almost secondary yeah I mean I think the secondary chronologically for sure at the end of the day this is a very technical practice and and having a real rigorous technical underpinning to all the treat your body is required otherwise what we’re doing is putting things out in the world that can’t really survive the rigors of operational life that’s gonna work yeah rockets out of work and it’s not a work up toward the designed for the desired end users right so we might have a different folks that were engaging in when we’re designing the dams were actually the operational users and that I think is when we say experience design we have to always remind our clients that actually we’re not just designing the experience for their gas than their end users and their their visitors were designing the experience and the tools and the work flow their operational teams are actually going to be engaged with her you know in a in the case of most of our permanent installations three five to ten years in the market show I’m going to go back to %HESITATION or the question %HESITATION just around this thing ability of these approaches right so if your an RGA or Victoria’s secret or one of our commercial real estate finance are worn architectures trying to create a space he’s kind of behaviors you’re absolutely right %HESITATION people see %HESITATION displays in a public space coming certainly from an A. B. R. she and there’s also I suspect we’re gonna see that as digital signage elation I’m one of the things that I try to distinguish is some %HESITATION first form factor and the way that the technology into the architecture so I’m you know our process which really is to lead %HESITATION design workshop with the stake holders on the client side their architects and designers and their story tellers and maybe an agency or maybe it’s an internal storytelling communication marketing brand function getting all those folks in the room at the same time %HESITATION is actually turned out to be revolutionary %HESITATION and it’s starting to happen more and more and so that allows us to really understand why are we doing this whose needs to serve one of the considerations in terms of the physical space out of the space unfold as we walk through it where the opportunities to add digital layers and then one of the materials that the architects using we take any cues off of those materials %HESITATION and forms and %HESITATION then design the way the technology in the space so you know getting ahead of the architectural process enough so that what we’re doing collectively doesn’t end up as high as architects caught affect any extra special equipment to get packed on the building afterwards this stuff really needs to be integrated capitalize integrated %HESITATION and then on the softer side of the project the the storytelling that becomes a software that creates behaviors it’s the same thing we’ve got may be yellow or communication Joby P. R. who’s trying to Gage with their particular audience I’m we already know from all the other channels that they communicate and that %HESITATION activating multiple sensors are often times more effective than %HESITATION then sort of just holing somebody down one input or the other and so %HESITATION they also have other channels they communicate and maybe they are in Trantor there and broadcaster their on line %HESITATION they have a big social media program there are all kinds of ways channel call these folks are getting it and the channel that we’re working into the new one we’re creating it as we go as a as an industry practice %HESITATION that really helping them understand that the the raw material that they’re already working with have a light in the unusual campuses arm but that it’s not necessarily a place where you want to just play your thirty seconds thirty second spot from your commercial campaign broadcast we can talk a little bit about why that %HESITATION necessarily translate directly but it didn’t it does go to the operational sustainability right I’m gonna have an appetite at the client for an architectural scale unusual side huge resolution requirements installation what’s gonna be out in the world for twenty four hour day installation nine thousand hours a year somebody’s got to reduce content or Chambliss that might be you know seventy times each day are that’s got a run for nine thousand ours year and be engaging more relevant on brand ecstatically %HESITATION and %HESITATION mostly that means it can’t be static can’t be some looping clay list it really has to take a different approach and I do the underpinning of our whole approach is this idea of evergreen media and what we mean by that yeah sounds like a huge undertaking many different stakeholders that you need to deal with to come together and come up with a plan you you also have the structural part that the mechanical part where early in the process putting your screens and really integrating them into the building which I’m sure is no small feat because that’s that’s got to be almost custom every time and then at the end there’s the contents where you’re actually taking all of that storytelling and %HESITATION are you providing the content as well and maybe tell me more about that idea ever been constant yeah well look to find content right because we think about content from a typical %HESITATION standpoint we think that that %HESITATION stills and job maybe audio stream Josh or in your video %HESITATION and if we say that that’s what content is then a content system is just there to take that existing static he produced and shove it in the play lists and play it back at the right time and that’s simply unsustainable especially if you want your scale to the enterprise reading %HESITATION one installation that takes that approach is may be painful for the operators but it’s it’s going to be something that they can meet the challenge you start to create dot the elation and you really need to find other ways software to find ways of describing what you want the behavior to be played display that play more of this play less of that in this market during this season when these people are in the store or these executives are visiting head quarters the rule based scheduling and we have to loosen what we mean by by content and everything that we previously described this content we actually start think of it so if content is the finished thing that you’re expecting to serve the meal assets are really the ingredients and %HESITATION in our systems what we’re trying to do is we’re using software that algorithmically generated Li uses those assets those photographs of those video clips of the brand might have combine them with data and that could be datasets that we’re divisional Ising in dynamic ways or could be data about what’s going on in the ecosystem of the brand or could be data about how people are behaving and moving and using physical space we combine those into a procedural Jenner there algorithmic visual engine that that we then say well that’s taking those assets and creating new dynamic content and the dynamic content can be %HESITATION most often in our projects being generated in real time and the fact that it’s real time generation means there can be responsive in real time server sensor feedback loops between our guest in the in the canvases can happen so all of those sort of ways of describing what we mean by evergreen %HESITATION in terms of the operational or content strategy I’m or the kind of responsiveness that you can expect are one way to think about it another way to think about it is that we’re going from a budgetary standpoint if you know invariably one of our stakeholders in the C. suite is gonna be the CEO %HESITATION hero and somebody who’s responsible for the real estate operation plant of the enterprise and they’re gonna need to know about how this thing physically goes into their world and how they’re gonna pay for it typically in their world on the other side there’s the storyteller and %HESITATION maybe he knows that he has a certain amount of marketing %HESITATION objects that can go against a campaign let’s say or an initiative imagine annualized budget so even figuring out how to get these projects funded sometimes interesting creative exercise because we might have to take %HESITATION you know the CEOs %HESITATION capital budget and the marketers %HESITATION objects budget and say well we have to find a different way to stitch together let’s go to the CFO and she can look at it from a bigger perspective and say oh I see if I shift a little bit more of our funding in this year into the capital budget for the research team I can think of what we’re installing is more of a class or an investment in the platform because if you do take the evergreen approach that we propose then what you’re doing is you’re saying I’m invest little bit more in this platform I’m gonna build content generation tools into this platform that my end users can create content on behalf of the brand where and then I’m going to find that I’m not spending all that marketing backs year after year after year feed the beast and that’s primarily you know really but the main question for us about about evergreen content approaches is how do we feed the beast and how do we design systems where we’re being responsible to not just the client was going to be thrilled with us on opening day but the client was gonna turn to us eighteen months into the engagement state this is amazing I want to scale to the enterprise I really think it’s important that last part about budgeting and that sounds on it that was really enlightening about because I think it gets back to the storytelling right what what’s the bottom line of that story telling white why are we doing this at all and that’s how we started is what is the why bottom I’d I’d like to talk a little bit more about that evergreen content I really think that’s an interesting thing and you described it as a mix of assets whatever they are images audio video and then adding data into that and then the output of that is real time content so I two questions can you give me a really simple example of that in real life and how the heck do you test something like that okay so an example %HESITATION actually give you two examples one which is %HESITATION an evergreen system that for all kinds of good design and and budgetary reasons %HESITATION couldn’t actually %HESITATION be realized as a real time system and yet we had to maintain the benefits of of evergreen for the client and then something that’s a little bit more %HESITATION directly us you know kicks off all the boxes so to speak it being a podcast I’m gonna wave my hands and described the images Stickley things that that you just can’t see how your listeners catchy but out in the web looking fine examples of this our work for Cadillac house so interestingly enough catalog moved their headquarters well years ago to New York City and specifically downtown into a very creative and vibrant %HESITATION part of of downtown in the Hudson street corridor and in moving they really wanted to engage with this new audience are not you know I’m not the car straight too much junk on behalf of them they do a good enough job of storytelling but there were not your grandfather’s Cadillac anymore were designed gripping and has always been this design group and innovation that really did create design objects that happened to be cars in that job and now I’m really sort of be understood that way and so they decided that they were gonna create this your experience based on their retail are grounds for our of the office building that they were moving into and are working with games where and they mean she sort of designed their medical space that house a processional Colin nodded takes you inside it has an almost fashion runways feeling and media %HESITATION layers are all over the place now we wanted to know you know how do we express ourselves on the line usual I mentioned seventy six times each D. R. was the worst actually the resolution of this campus so in order to create that kind of blaster at the high quality and %HESITATION again nine thousand hours of unique programming a year you start to understand very quickly that there’s no way that a marketing budget is going to support the branch agencies producing bad amount of your content at that resolution and die and get right so we started to introduce them to the idea of evergreen can we get along the way was we discovered that they had this treasure trove of database of photographic design details from everything that they’ve designed and produced over the decades really loving detail so you know hubcap Rome details and stitching on leather and the way the man the sheet metal would bend around %HESITATION the the the rear bumper of a car gorgeous %HESITATION examples of their design abstract this you know making cars so we found that this was a your troubles I sort of raw materials and that if we could add meta data should those are that photographic material we could actually call it up into little front end systems that we created that allowed them to make these kaleidoscope so these Mondrian ash patterns or or or %HESITATION and so we created a series of zero modules generative software models that took those raw materials and by bringing certain expressive you know her amber’s really can better knobs out chewed this non technical non design trained and user at Cadillac then they can sit there and call up certain color tonalities or certain %HESITATION really just filter by by meta data to get down to a pool of content that feels like the raw material and then she’d that into the generative algorithms so I’m doctor system where we really are taking what we think of as latent asset latent asset but are kicking around the brand and that goes for the video content as well so publicist was out %HESITATION in so ho shooting the the broadcast campaign on the cars going through so ho beautiful architecture cobbled streets well we don’t want to and really can’t in a reasonable way %HESITATION but back to Marshall in into this architectural campus it wouldn’t work however if we ask them first and be role we first ask them to start shooting at four K. that we ask them first and beer all and what we end up with is more raw material that again is in line with the brand and the way the brand is communicating today so if I am on %HESITATION in front of the television is rare but I hear your Cadillac commercial and I see this beautifully shot environment and data it makes an impression on me now I’m walking down and I go by three thirty Hudson and I look inside and on the columns are moving into the space I see some of the same %HESITATION from the same material not edited the same way which clearly are the same made of the same stuff as without all of a sudden makes the connection that reinforces our whatever it is that I like to try to get across so that’s kind of the idea I’m not actually end up being somewhere we designed a what we call just in time rendering so we wanted all the benefits of being able to create content on the fly but the budget simply couldn’t be justified to say we need this to be real time because we actually wanted to be interactive in anyway so we created something that would %HESITATION all the benefits of that algorithmic creation but do it off line and then deliver media just in time they’ve been freshly baked %HESITATION into a more commodity does digital signage in part to kind of best of both worlds keeping you know all the GPU money that would be needed for all the hardware in the basement and %HESITATION minimizing that while giving them all the flexibility of the that sounds like a really fun project what was terrific yeah yeah I can imagine so I guess once you designed these projects and you’re ready to start acting on it you must internally have a bunch of different members different ways of making sure that just for example the programming works so I’m guessing you’re using more modern programming practices you’re running unit tests on certain functions and then at the end you kind of hand over this very complicated thing can you talk a little bit about that process yeah absolutely so I think everything that we deliver can be understood really as an ecosystem ecosystem of services tied together by communications or singles are API call them right and in the aggregate ecosystem that is actually doing the work of creating you know treating this media and exhibiting behaviors space and paying attention to our %HESITATION occupants in gas and clothing the feedback loop so %HESITATION you know even our software stock is a little a collective great so we have maybe what our guests are mostly perceiving is the output of what we think of as our front then are you combination of generative and %HESITATION and I’m gonna Torio play back systems and those are specialized to be very robust and handle ridiculous numbers of output are in you know hardware strange saying and it’s also where all of the %HESITATION you know maybe we’re using a I style transfer techniques to take us use of images and bring them into a certain difference that I could maybe we’re using including commodity video and using our computer graphics techniques to make them look like water colors in motion or were taking a data set and general I you know visualizing it and using a particle so that’s where all that work man behind that is %HESITATION %HESITATION obviously are middle where which we called in doctor if you think about it really is an air traffic control real time non blocking I owe based messaging platform it’s also parsing all the logic so if I have input from our sensor fusion system which is what we used to pay attention to occupants in arbitrary scaled spaces well then I when I say oh well when it when all the people walking into this commercial buildings lobby in the morning I want to know how many they are where they’re going and how much they’re lingering versus going straight to the elevators so that I can doctor is able to take that real time input and the rules that have been taken to %HESITATION a content management system and choreograph all these are all these activities across the system and then below that we get into %HESITATION no I guess in some ways more the commoditized side of the stock which is I would pretty database agnostic your client has something for proscribed or or or wants to be an Mongo our house we can effectively work within any of those environments all of our stuff on top so you said testing and I think before there can be testing of anything there needs to be clarity on what it is that we want to do when it’s working right and so we tend to model these things a lot %HESITATION everything we’ve built %HESITATION in ninety percent of what we build will never be seen by us or the client until it your all on site all be different stranger coming into the station but I’ve been traveling on different paths for months and months so if we think about our responsibility to manage your client’s risk in taking a chance of doing something new are in the built environment which is you know that’s just a recipe for and it’s our responsibility to manage it we do so by prototyping and mocking up and the increasingly were using pre visualization so you know what but taking three bears out of bed here’s a rendering of what this might look like all the way ju eighty working has doubled the integration test of how these things are working out all explain that so we might start in %HESITATION with the model of the space arm just architectural massing model make sure that into a game engine and put ourselves in our clients and goggles not everybody can read plans well even if they do it doesn’t dimensional space necessarily so we can move through this prostration let’s understand how this based on old where the opportunities are %HESITATION what scale feels right what different view viewpoints are in vantage points are in the future and then let’s start what canisters into that game engine virtual twin of our of our project so now we can start to see how media might play in the race but it’s still just you know Karen textures on a yacht on the surface within the model %HESITATION so then we can start a well %HESITATION we can use the game engine to actually introduce game characters who behave like our users are going to behave and we can track them and then we can see that %HESITATION does blogs are that info into the generative system and actually feed into real time %HESITATION textures does the visual products do not you think about it we created a whole feedback loop between the space the sensitivity to the occupants and the generation of media but we’ve done it all virtually so we think about that as a sort of like %HESITATION that model is almost a digital twin of the ecosystem that we’re gonna create %HESITATION and now that we have these facsimiles of the building and of the campus and all we can actually test all of the other software pieces %HESITATION in that virtual eyes against bad virtualize difficult when and then obviously because we’re in physical reality eventually we’re partnering up with the integrators and going to their shops and bring all the tests that need to happen %HESITATION to ensure that all of this early risk management actually bears out %HESITATION but it starts it starts there and it does allow us to do testing on is that in that have to connect to one another in order to do the job but that what actually need each other over on site well sounds pretty amazing %HESITATION it’s the idea is great but the years somebody who actually executes on it takes out the goggles put something in a game engine even simulates the people will be using the space that it sounds like a lot of fun do you think there is %HESITATION what what kind of a scalable projects do you need to have to do that much testing in front and work all of the amount of testing I think the process scales up and down yeah I mean look bizarre everybody’s talking about divine thinking right so it’s the you know if we think about and I’m thinking well it can be applied to %HESITATION creating at a city or can be designed for treating are used to treat a room or you know it’s really %HESITATION it’s really more of an approach and so object that has the intersection and the risk taking meaning innovation desire right so the issue if if the client and the project team have an innovation desire and their intersecting these kind of storytelling in pure creative with software with with systems then the same techniques apply you may need do less of it %HESITATION we’re not just doing it for fun we’re doing it because we actually want to be in that end up being a kind of fun but we’re not doing it for fun we’re doing it because it helps us be responsible in our clients in in in in commercial projects and I think a lot of your listeners will resonate with this I mean they’re putting us six seven eight years of capital at risk sure %HESITATION and so are we’re going to survive and thrive in in business is going to be because we took responsibility for that rest and so this is really just a way to manage that that risk in search for %HESITATION when you don’t have something to play with or test against being creative and using internet design techniques is really tough you just have to kind of gas and hope that you did what they did they did a good job and that’s not what this can work even on a on a on a smaller project to work on a project that doesn’t even have quite as much %HESITATION I don’t know is that this is really just another way to do right a software defined by a reality are you working on anything interesting that you’d like to share with us now or in the future yes are the first part know anything about what I can share I think I think you know what else what else stays best %HESITATION there are opportunities that we found %HESITATION and I think you know a lot of your audience are unstoppable occurs %HESITATION maybe show control or our supervisory automation system programmers are working within an increasingly software divide decide to find %HESITATION environment and %HESITATION one of the things that you’re trying to be right now and yes we have some incredible %HESITATION %HESITATION client work about to launch and I bite the come check out our website but I think what one of the great love to touch on is I’m so creative does it mean that you’re being inefficient in terms of how you’re building your own tools because one school of thought as well custom custom custom custom custom all the time first of all it’s gonna be very expensive second of your wallet gonna be very inefficient folks who are actually doing the work whether it’s an individual coder or a team or a larger company %HESITATION how are you going to retain some of that intellectual property in that some that know how and actually build usable modular tool kit that allows you to yes you something genuinely creative and new and responsive to the needs of any particular quiet but it doesn’t require you and your team to start scratch %HESITATION at every step so I think that that’s something that we’ve been exploring that I’m super excited about a little under the hood but it’s really about the sort of optimization of are a lot of the work that we’ve been doing one example there is a platform that we’re calling sensor fusion and %HESITATION you know if you go and take a look at our work you’ll see that were instrumental in the spaces are typically with a combination of light are thermal imaging cameras are an act I will not connect anymore but were back and %HESITATION and then getting into legislation energy positioning systems will be can just try to be sensitive to how people are using the space that might be a public environment might be retail it might be a show room %HESITATION we’re just trying to be sensitive to how people are using space of the band low so we realized that we were using all kinds of different sensors we would have a large space where we needed very low resolution understanding of the behavior we might throw a light are up in the air and cover you know ten thousand square feet but Dan in certain areas were really looking for a little bit more granular detail and are these people facing the screens are they looking away are they using their arms to try to interact with us Sir and then down at the finer grain you know things like we have motion incentives like that %HESITATION allow us to understand what fingers are doing if we put a good people and you transponder into space now we can actually track individuals phones or %HESITATION or are so deep Bob’s effectively passion %HESITATION dad were handing out the centimeter within the space so all the different scales what’s called from %HESITATION we try to synthesize into one model so we now have this %HESITATION %HESITATION this platform such as using the devolved over you know two or three years allowed just because of the company we are you know we keep doing that let’s figure out a way to really do it well and to create a tool that allows us to keep going back to that well and every project we recently did a project which is when we added the Bluetooth low energy layer because we’ve got all this is all great but I need a unique identifier so let’s add this layer and all these different layers who were you know light are you know berries acronyms all coming to this one %HESITATION coherent world model of the digital twin again I’m I’m very fond of that term these days a little twin of the way that our people needs spaces are behaving and it really active service so earlier when we talked about section the other systems and how you catch them how you boy %HESITATION center fusion of the service and I find %HESITATION he’s a friend and talk with us looking to know about generally speaking are most people moving into the space or moving out of the state without asking doctor also he can doctor can you tell me what center fusion has to say about this scale behavior but if I’m an interactive that’s over in the corner and I need to know how that individual standing two meters away facing me is just regulating with their arms I’m gonna ask the doctor the past means that you’re fusion us your whole skeletal tracking model for that user in that part of the space really does kind of create an obstruction layer across across all the different I’m sick and that you know a little under the hood but from right technical and intellectual property development standpoint I think that might be interesting to some of your ideas and the from the sounds of it perhaps in those tools will be available to other companies some day H. interesting I mean so far we’re kind of making dog food for ourselves round and %HESITATION just making sure it’s tasty and and the and the Christians but absolutely right you start to think about them well first of all it means that we can start to engage with clients in something other than a %HESITATION %HESITATION no ownership model or everything starts from scratch is really something we can license that into our are quite work we’ve done some more development actually on our own are what we call our message is this remote monitoring system that allows all our systems to phone home and tell our out managed services spoke about how things are going and %HESITATION these are all things that are distinct unit of functionality and could absolutely be making those available to our %HESITATION allowed collaborators or to the market in general solution that people can use just haven’t thought that far into the go to market yeah it certainly sounds interesting %HESITATION I hated to use a term like this but it sounds a lot like what I. O. T. promises or one of the things that I would see like a good application of it in the real space I would argue the mother would be tricky words I think that you know gas so I think you know I I turn on the of the internet you know %HESITATION and and what are they and how do they behave individually %HESITATION the idea of decentralizing the functionality interests wrinkling %HESITATION a layer of technology into space and organizing it software defined way so that it can be used for a particular purpose %HESITATION is absolutely in line with this thank you are and in stock if you think about you know the way building management systems are also a version of I got all these centers and thermostat in occupancy and there’s not any other we’re trying to understand the behavior of this building so that we can tune canticle lexical it’s whatever it all those systems are often times a service that will actually plug into so if we can work with you know %HESITATION let’s say we’ve got you know amazing engineering firm on the project traits Arabs and they’re working on an interesting building management system and we say Hey folks that is there a way that we can pay attention to your occupancy sensors because if we can bring that into our world we can integrate them into our understanding of how people work were moving to the states so knows those kind of I guess I would he bothers I achieved borrows from internet in that everything is designed to be interconnected and that is the aggregate behavior of interconnected things that gives us the desired functionality I’m so totally in line are you absolutely spot on yeah cnet networks of things have been around for a long long time it’s it’s actually nothing new it sounds like we’re gonna have to follow up in a year or so and then see what happens with us sensor fusion and conductor and how that all works out in the vaults and if anybody would like to get in touch with you how they go about doing that well are absolutely %HESITATION more than happy to %HESITATION connected strokes and I’m on the very spot forms you can find me on the day and %HESITATION and I’m not really responsive and %HESITATION %HESITATION should be an email and David at the V. dash controls are excellent David thank her being on the podcast really appreciate it great chatting for anyone on your staff ever considered themselves just in eighty programmer join the club that’s how I used to feel I was just an amex programmer just Crestron program or whatever language of your choice is whatever it may be there’s generally this feeling in AV that we’re not capable of using modern programming languages and it simply isn’t true sure there’s a learning curve but once you get through it all other languages become easier to learn and it just expands the amount of options you have when designing a system it’s not an either or decision you don’t say I won’t be using these manufacture tools anymore it’s just you have a broader palate to choose from ends here’s what market day founder of idea box had to say about his experience with the online courses at learn eighty programming dot com you know Patrick it’s funny how the smallest things can sometimes be the star of really big ideas %HESITATION before I took the learn ATV programming dot com courses I was in that Terry I’m only a control system programmer kind of mindset rate %HESITATION when he came to new technologies or current technologies like Java script error or things like that for some reason I thought that was different from what I’m doing and what taking your courses flipped for me was not so much what I learned technically taking the courses it was the mindset of well wait a second I’m already doing ninety nine percent of what some of these most of modern programmers are dealing I just have to learn %HESITATION you know the other one percent and that’s really what I did so it’s really been kind of a big change after taking the course %HESITATION and I would really recommend this course to any integrator not only will obviously help their skill set but more importantly it might change their whole mindset %HESITATION which is more important and and and really show them new opportunities open the door so they kind of see problems through a different lens %HESITATION I gotta tell you one of the biggest changes for me was as soon as I become myself HTML CSS javascript and solve the you guys that I can make with those technologies I just couldn’t sell a %HESITATION Crestron touch him again mark is a great example of somebody who takes new information and really applies it I know that mark still sells a lot of Crestron equipment but for him for his company for his customers for his business he needed a better you why he needed another option for user interface and modern programming allowed him to do that so the question is how can you use modern programming to improve your business please go to learn AV programming dot com and wherever you see a sign up button go ahead and sign up and you’ll get some free information to get a feel of my learning style and what kind of information is available and of course it would be an honor to have you in role in one of our courses and help you upgrade your skills and take this industry to the next level thanks for listening software defined survival I hope you found it useful and maybe it inspires you to try out something new this week if you have any questions does software defined survival dot com and click the appropriate I’d love to answer questions on the air and if you’d like to help spread the word please subscribe comment and share it with thanks