Lee Rivers talks about how programmers can guarantee AV project success by working directly with
consultants and end users.
Transcript...
this is a software defined survival where we talk to AB IT professionals and software developers to find out how to leverage software to reinvent ourselves and we do business we listen to their stories and ask for advice and tactics on how to survive and thrive in a software defined what today software defined survive and then I get there and then it project manager got none and I we want this button to do this and do that easy rider writing way it’s going to be handed out of it you know the next day and it’s like two weeks worth of work we need some money from someone with an understanding the banking code what’s required all understanding how to really it’s not so easy and that really wanted and this space pasted to stand up and take control of this whole prices because it was a safe space it really understand these prices Haiti Patrick here just a quick recap of my week before we get on with the interview I just got back from Amsterdam where I attended Crestron master training event it’s the year two thousand eighteen in case you’re listening to this sometime in the future ends quite honestly I almost did not go but on the recommendation of my body Steve Greenblatt he really encouraged me to go and he was right it was the right thing to do because I was really surprised about some of the things that I’ve heard now in AV one of the things I’ve been talking about for a long time is this whole software defined stuff using modern programming tools to %HESITATION do your automation and control and pretty much all the traditional control manufacturers have been hesitant to take that approach because I understand it right quite frankly they’ve put a lot of resources into creating proprietary control systems proprietary ID ease in software and they have all the support structures and dealers who are trained up in this stuff I completely understand that and on top of that their tools work great they do what they should but from my perspective once I started using iOS swift and Java script with no J. S. ends working with other developers and subcontracting work out to other developers it became very difficult to go back to those tools because it’s just a completely different development environment so I think there’s a place for everything there’s a time and a place for these traditional tools there’s certainly more of a role that modern tools could be playing and that’s why I was really blown away this week when I attended a class at this Crestron events where they announced that their touch panels will be programs with HTML five CSS and Java script and they will not be providing an ID touch panel designers will be expected to use modern web development tools to create their touch panels and this is a complete paradigm shift it’s a total one eighty from that closed proprietary system approach because now basically you create a web page and it could run anywhere I could run on your laptop it could on on any browser any could also run on Crestron touch panels so this completely opens up the weight AV projects can be done on the touch panel side because we have so many more resources now you could hire any web developer to make a whiz bang touch panel ends you could re use that however you like you could serve it up from somewhere browse to it from your phone you could package it up as your own app and you could brand that out and I think this is a really big deal because let’s face it Crestron is a really big company and when they do things like that people will pay attention to it so I’m really excited about the things that I’ve heard this week ends also their touch panels will be running android so it looks like you may even be able to run your own applications right on the touch panel so this is really exciting stuff and along with some of the other things that I saw this week like the the partnership with apps space a digital signage company starts to make sense because the run that digital signage platform it’s basically HTML web pages so it kind of makes sense that they’ll move in this direction and of course all the video I. P. over IP was a big big thing that we talked about this week and quite frankly he V. systems are going to have to be done differently they’re going to have to be designed and plans quite differently even a good CAD drawing you know the days of of writing on the back of a napkin or certainly over but even a good CAD drawing will not be enough to get buy in from IT professionals so the landscape certainly is changing and one of the biggest takeaways that I took away from this week is that Evey programmers and software minded integrators are really the ones who are best positioned to shepherd in this new paradigm of AV IT and software defined AV IT on a technical level sure obviously that’s why we’re best position because we understand things so deeply what needs to be done and the order in the way it needs to be done but on a business side I think we have a lot to improve on and that’s why today’s guest gives us a lot of tips about how to change your business and really take advantage of the opportunities that are waiting for us so let’s get on with the interview my name is Patrick Murray welcome to software defined survival I’m here Chris Johnson master training two thousand eighteen in Amsterdam and I’ve met some interesting people and one of them is my guest here today and being that I’m a masters I have not had a chance to look at is linked in profile and give the typical background so I’ll just let him do that himself Louie rivers welcome to software defined survival how are you today things country can you tell us a little bit about your background how you got it starred in a movie and not all that sure %HESITATION yes I’ve been doing this for about thirty seven years sort of my background was initially doing invent some and %HESITATION as a DJ and production and then sort of went into the I AB side of things in regards to silos and technical and installation and they need to programming and project management and running says as a senior project manager and yeah so it’s kind of pretty much everything in the industry all kind of have a doubling and had to play with excellent and what was that initial impulse to get into a V. what what was like your first project or %HESITATION probably as a DJ but both my brothers with the Jason so it kind of was in the family and %HESITATION and yeah I like a lot I used to set a mark around this kid doing recordings and and that sort of thing so I was really not very much into music to really enjoy it cool thank that pops up a lot there it is again music usually it’s guitar something that we’ve got a DJ on the show and %HESITATION yeah that’s a recurring theme that music is a gateway drug for a fee which is it different so %HESITATION could you tell me a bit about your most successful project and and what made it special for you I guess the %HESITATION the not so much the lightest that probably one of the biggest I did was set on a few years back I did a project for the department of education and it was somewhat different to this standard project in that %HESITATION always working directly with the consultant and always engaged by the client to actually do the programming commissioning which meant that the SI was the one that actually just supplied with equipment and installation and I did all the programming commissioning full that project working directly with the consultant and the and the and the client take Mike showed that the interface is we’re going to deliver exactly what I wanted %HESITATION and the project end up becoming %HESITATION %HESITATION will actually like we had the guys coming out from integrate at magazine to do a just a cover story on and %HESITATION and it wasn’t long before I see in two thousand seventeen and %HESITATION and then we found out that bag she had put herself for the international war practically you without you asking for yeah without a sign asking for it we digest and and when it was only like about two weeks out from the shot and so I you know I wasn’t trying to guide to I see because I was already coming a masters in Amsterdam and it’s a long way from Australia to to come here so it was at a big commitment to it be up to come twice but two weeks out and found out that would be nominated in the consultants at night you betta get tickets even a common we came to Amsterdam and I’m surprisingly we actually won the international project of the year which we went expecting because there was seven of the major projects from around the world and it wasn’t a large project but the innovation in the project and how it all went together and the client was just over the moon with that and it worked really really well and kind of %HESITATION from there it’s sort of staying rounding to me looking into more working with consultants and and the end user to get a pet a outcome and I guess that’s probably out of all the projects that are done browsing the projects are done over the years that was someone and I guess what’s with the United a stand out the most so I’m looking at that projects what really set it apart for you was that direct contacts with the consultant generex yet and definitely early on in the in the prices so you know I I I’m just speaking to people he and everyone has exactly the same issues with you know when they’re working at that sees the %HESITATION and sort of working we %HESITATION system in a crisis this it’s usually time is always the issue you know and I don’t have the time to be able to scope it out probably ended really get %HESITATION might be to talk to the end user client to really understand what the requirements are from from the client’s perspective side they do their best and then I get there and then it project manager got none and I we want this button to do this and do that do that subtle changes in its usually right at the end of the project way it’s got to be handed over the you know the next day and it’s like two weeks worth of work to trying to facilitate the requirements and and you know if Ian seems to be getting set up the file all the way along the trying said to be able to be engaged on very very early crisis you know we were spending we spent a lot of time developing the actual touch panel layouts before any code was actually written so it worked out perfectly and so when it come time to to trying to with no changes required because it was all worked out that’s really a really interesting you know I’m really excited about this whole idea and because it’s the same old song and dance that’s being set up for failure happens over and over again so I’m really excited about this idea of %HESITATION getting involved as early as possible but that’s easier said than done right so do you have any usually I ask for advice at the end of the park as but let’s just jump right into it do you have any practical tips for anyone who wants to get closer to the origin of the project yeah definitely look I I think that some as program is we’re always at the coal face and we can bring a lot to the title when it comes to helping al consultants and even system going into great dissident doing design construct talk works all I believe and this is what I did which took me a long time I spend a lot of time meeting with consultants and meeting with you know a system integrators and just explaining to them what you know how I can deliver for them and and what we can do to to help them when they designing from a design perspective without understanding the packing code what’s required for understanding how to really do a good interface %HESITATION it’s not so easy for an a so I or even that the consultants to be able to %HESITATION paint a picture for the client so when we come on board we know what works what doesn’t work and we can explain that to the client and then we can find at the intricacies of what I require one of the issues there they’re experiencing and how can we in code and in the in the face %HESITATION be able to provide that and why this is gonna be easy for them to use excellent so the benefits sure if you’re in early you have more time right you don’t have that time crunch at the ends obviously contacts to the end user that you could really understands what what issues they’re trying to solve what what kind with their solutions should look like those of the benefits has there been any %HESITATION challenges that have been introduced by getting in so early is there anything that any negatives to it a look they res %HESITATION obviously when you change the way things get done in any industry you can have some sort of resistance and so I found the wrist any resistance at all I’ve experienced is mainly from the system in a crisis %HESITATION by it you know I see me as a threat %HESITATION as you know that I’m taking away part of the works %HESITATION button in actual fact %HESITATION every project that I have run with this model %HESITATION has worked perfectly with the client and then actually might system integrator look bad on %HESITATION because nine times out of ten that the the the product mix delivered is not exactly what the client wanted all the consultant had this online %HESITATION because of all the time limitations in money because I mean that was a tender arrangement with that putting the pricing as cheap as possible just get in and get out and then run on variations to try and actually make some money out of the project by the way doing it is not about you know looking variations it’s about being up to understand what are the deliverables from from the outset so that we can actually deliver that to the client rather than how we got to get in and get out in a certain period of time so how does integrators flips have they changed their mind set after going through the process look some have %HESITATION some haven’t I mean you can’t change everybody but I think in the long time people will see the benefits of this model excellent so let’s get down to some practical details what does the process look like so there’s a consultant who has a project you’re on board to help him what are some some of the steps some of the tasks that you actually do and and the timing of those tests like I so depending on where the projects are sometimes we just organize like assume chorus or Scott call with the client or all the key stakeholders that again we utilize the for the day the %HESITATION the system or to maybe %HESITATION services system or their own internal IT or to all IT departments have everybody involved that would like to have input in the eye roll you know you soul operation of the system %HESITATION side that’s the first thing is to be able to scope it out a lot of the times like for instance of a recently did a university project where they had like six different types of of the legacy touch panel laughs and what we did was we tried to everyone of them and we said I chi what’s the good the bad and the ugly for each one of these and then basically grabbed all the good bits and try to get it all together and and and documented a once I will let’s let’s work from this and and basically built %HESITATION a touch panel out having all the functionality within the one system and then sort of guy from there so it gave us a framework of way to stop from %HESITATION and then where I would be able to do it and build and build until it got him absolutely everything that I wanted to do but still easy for an ID educators to you because you know the light at the end of the day to day the guys that are going to be able to get out there and just be able to you know select one button and the whole system turns on the white guys it’s gonna be very easy for them to be able to do that pot from the the people that are actually the intent of life you know like two guys I know the issues they’re experiencing and I to die Dino the floors in the existing systems and I can provide that feedback from there you sort of given a really good clear roadmap of what you’re going to deliver once you’ve got nice touch panels done in light and light out the coding is easy because it’s normal cry it’s it’s really black and white yeah that’s come up several times to programming is actually easy once everything is defined so just to recap real quickly step one is talk right talk with the end users see see with their their needs are step to analyze if they have anything already really take a good look at it what’s the good what’s the bad and step three is documentation so you’ve mentioned touch panels several times %HESITATION does does your value really revolve around the coup we interface or is that just part of it is it is there more to it than that look I believe the Kiwis probably ID percent of it to be honest %HESITATION seriously because at the end of the day the people that are all private that I’m K. one brandies it’s irrelevant it’s just about the user experience and I that’s bandied around a lot of Instagram at the user experience but it really is about the user experience so if you can get thank you we rely and make it nice and easy %HESITATION you know your job done do you have any way to %HESITATION it was not do we rooms are and so %HESITATION keypads or it real animation where there’s just sink detection or or things like that maybe even voice control yeah look I think can sink detection yes %HESITATION haven’t done a lot of key pad type stuff from because typically the systems are out of work on a usually quite large and complex said there’s not a lot of that sort of requirement and made the point I want to range where Mike in their breakout room or you know since a little meeting rooms about that %HESITATION that %HESITATION haven’t done any yet voice control but definitely interested in in in sort of looking into that area okay so you’ve got the functionality defines in whatever the user interface is going to be let’s say it’s a good week you’ve got that defines with some just wire frames or is it a full blown %HESITATION graphic design do you put some text in there to describe things give me an idea what that was don’t do that we want to climb into the client is not something sometimes you can be just a simple yes actually doing all the touch panels because you gonna do them anyway you’ve already got the job so much of the touch panels and then screenshot to send it to the client and then if you can have a meeting them to be able to explain how it’s the the functions working things out that really depends on the complexity of the of of what the project days you know if it’s just a basic little meeting rooms are not that that’s one thing that’s you know you really kind of to get into it too much if it’s more like a more complex you know meeting room board room or you know a multi purpose to offering where it split into three range of things out that then you getting them more complexity in you need to actually get down to the nitty gritty and you need to have everybody spying on on we have to get that information sure and numb once that’s approved and everybody agrees on everything what are the next steps are probably pretty obvious but just take me through that case a missing anything side typically once that some of the that signed off for me that’s the next step for me to get my next progress payments %HESITATION because for me it’s all well and good to be able to do the work but if you’re not managing risk of business that’s the other part of mapping of the program is it is it it’s it’s a business as well you know you gotta make sure that you you managing cash flow and you managing that that you you get you made a milestone in you you put any invoicing and once anymore spine then you get a next step and you’ve clearly defined that from the outset so the client really knows what are the key points along the way so once you’ve got that signed off and you you know you put invoicing in you being tied for the ice man a works then it’s getting on to the programming I’m saving up the program and you know maybe you can you know do some off site testing you know you might have a little crisis you go home and be able to actually play tricks and all that sort of stuff working and anything else that you can test as much as possible I like to try and have pretty much most of the code components completely finished before I go to start and stop loading the other thing that from there is that would be really dumped on and make sure that the system integrator is completely understanding of what is required before the program is going to get someone you know make sure that a lot of the RP information’s being supplied to the dive down all their system testing and so on exam that might show the days you know anything it for their one night you know Wallace and for for the yeah program to going in and load understanding that you know who seems in control of the commissioning side of things and that sort of thing and basically it it’s just run like a project you know you’re going to have more you different elements of what’s going to be done and and it’s done in in in in time once the programming is done then it’s putting in time to say a couple of programs done now I’m ready to come to sought once they’re ready and then somebody it’s another %HESITATION and then it’s the final go to sign in to you funneled lighting and testing and commissioning and trying excellent %HESITATION I usually have a note pad and take notes but I’ve got a bright rely on my memory for now so there were a couple things I want to touch on %HESITATION you mention payment as being a critical part of the process it’s not all fun and games you know the as technical people we we like to have fun we enjoy our jobs but %HESITATION I like the way you you place that importance on there it’s got to be part of the project processes when we we paid for what tasks so I think that’s a really think important thing to note and of course you did the programming because that’s %HESITATION when you’re background where you come from but there’s also this installation part so it almost sounded like you become there’s a transition between where you’re doing some consultancy on on what the final solution looks like and then you transition almost to a project manager do you help select the %HESITATION as a systems integrator and and then can you talk a bit about the transition from being a consultant to a project manager yeah look down at the moment in the role that have been doing we %HESITATION the consultants there’s no real involvement and he’s getting shot in a chosen to to do the work in regards to the tender process of %HESITATION %HESITATION by in demand definitely with the project management I’m actually managing my part of the project and on making sure that I know in advance when I’m required on site on like show that Dave because you know what they ducks in line of Donald a big that I need to tell you because it’s all about ensuring that I understand what my requirements on before he shot because I don’t want to get the site and I’m not going to work %HESITATION because just wasting everybody’s time yeah so is so once a project is installed and complete and accepted is that the end of the projects because I kind of have this idea of if you look at software development you’ve reached version one and then there’s a long time between that between version one release and when that system reaches end of life and that tends to be ignored a lot in AV do take that into account and all and and what does it look like for you you look alike to run have the chance to be able to go and get back to the client and just see how even it’s going you know just to calling you can just have a coffee just to see how it’s all going but also I I I tried to exceed in case they mean to you know providing some sort of found a service agreement you know from the from the %HESITATION %HESITATION uniting site com you know for more updates and and %HESITATION you know testing is systems and stuff like that I mean it’s all well and good to be installed will have certain you know my idea slicing in place but from a from a code in an operational taught us perspective %HESITATION I’d like to have make sure that my relationship with the client is still strong and in any changes they want to do United gonna come straight to me every time just to just to make sure that %HESITATION you know what it is going to be done in code can be facilitated excellent excellent yeah you mentioned %HESITATION %HESITATION says security updates and we just sat in a class together where you know the big take away for me was if security is a feature if you view security as a future then you should be updating firmware regularly that’s that’s a part of it yeah and so so it is a little bit loose right it’s it’s not really an a contract is not part of a documented part of the work flow but you definitely keep in touch with the end user is so is there anything else that %HESITATION that you’re working on that you’d like to share with us any plans for the future you plan on doing anything with this model or just continue to execute it on your own yeah look I am working at the moment %HESITATION to put together a %HESITATION it basically I’m looking at building strategic alliances with people not just in a stripe around the world there are like minded and wants to set a time you know I’m take more control of where the going in and advice to give themselves the opportunity to actually succeed in business rather than just you know I get the cards dealt with in and and I’ve got to put up with it and tried to do the best I can with with what’s dealt to them %HESITATION and so in saying that odds actually got some alliances throughout history of cuts and make a line in the U. S. that we’ve been talking with and there’s been quite a few people that I’ve met here at %HESITATION at monsters that I getting at are asking the same questions that everybody else is asking their own experience the same issues so you know just saying this model is saying how works and and and a sexy sits a few places in the U. S. that are actually running exactly this model %HESITATION and it’s working really really well and in talking with some some of the head guys here Crestron a dinner last night and he said the time that we’re trying to get people from from CS pasted to to run this model the ease and and yeah and that really wanted and this space pasted to to stand up and take control over this whole crisis because it was a serious piece it really understand this crisis and now hoping that that we’re up to do that now I can understand why it hasn’t and because everybody’s different you know some people %HESITATION management people some people out another ticket to known that big data really just want to get in because I really don’t want to be client facing that really don’t want to be running a business is such two as a business development manager they just wanna write code and I want to do any voice and I want to work on the next job not so bright image finding you can earn good money that way but essentially if you want to be you know in charge here and destiny and you want to be able to work on some pretty amazing stuff and be involved from the outset and rather than sort of you know on my small of being rude being a much like a bottom feda you know you you get to the top of the pack and then so you will be working at that high level you really need to be able to have strategic alliances with those people that can actually help you to get to that point and so you sort of working together and it becomes you know it’s a win win deal for everybody that’s involved when I know I believe in life you gotta love what you do when you get away with doing a lot allies that were actually going to enjoy that and will likely we work in the industry that pretty much every on that I’m not in the industry level I do you know it’s it’s a fun industry line %HESITATION side that’s a first base so you got to be happy with what you’re doing and I believe you got to be in control of your own destiny not like if you sitting there and being upset of the county got a date you getting dealt stymied getting you pack now it’s time to move on and and and take control of yourself and if you can’t do it yourself align yourself with people that are going to help you be able to get a you know help them to get with any ticket and you help them and I help you when you when you know it you’ll go along the path together and it’s amazing what you can actually chase absolutely inspiring stuff you you’ve got me all fired up and I can’t wait to get home and start executing on some of this and %HESITATION based on some of the things we’re seeing here this training software is really going to be more of a part of the way AT projects are done and %HESITATION we’re going to have to develop software development cracks practices we will not be sitting on a cable school behind Iraq doing things last minute so the industry will have to change and a lot of the things you said about you know taking charge of your own destiny I really think it’s time for for AB programmers and software minded people to stand up and say yeah we could do this and %HESITATION and to get to it so if anybody would like to get in touch with you we’re gonna follow up probably some time and a half for your your so and and see where this whole journey takes us but if anybody like to get such a few in the meantime how they go about doing that and you can get to it contact me through I linked in this one way I’m all up and leave at on my dash excel the XC L. dot com today you excellent thank you so much for being on the show early thanks Patrick hate Patrick Ewing and thanks for listening to the show if you enjoyed this discussion if you liked what you’ve heard if you want to hear more discussions like this please go to I tunes legal review to the show send me a comment get in touch with me somehow and let me know that you’re out there listening and that’ll motivate me to keep doing these shows get more so if you’re driving or whatever to set something in your calendar to give you a reminder to go to I tunes thanks for listening to software defined survival for transcripts and show notes go to software defined survival dot com